there's nothing magical about caribou hide, nor seal, polar bear, muskox hide

[Tugaloo]

You do not mention moving about camp to include waste management, ever try to have a bowel movement at -25 f? It takes time! What about gathering fire wood to warm your shelter? Not to mention hunting/fishing.

Why would we want to move camp when everything we need is here?

You've mentioned a farm where a lot of others and you will go? Are y'all planning on leaving it because of waste management?

We live in the Chattahoochee NF forest; so gathering wood is not a problem. You sound as if you live in an urban area.

Here -25° is not on the table as it doesn't get that cold here.

Dig a hole and leave human waste in it for 6 to 12 months, then use it for fertilizer.
https://www.homesteadinhawaii.com/ca...as-fertilizer/

[Garand]

unfortunately

[Tugaloo]

Sourdough, I feel very sorry that you are dealing with Macula Degeneration, my mother suffered through it for almost a decade at the end of her life. It is not a pleasant way to experience your golden years. As for pooping in the bush in -0F temperatures, I can reflect on earlier experiences of field exercises in Fort Wainwright Alaska and Northern Canada when I was a young soldier, never an enjoyable experience.

Well said Garand!

Both my wife's parents had Macula Degeneration; her father was affected the most. As it is genetic, it is a concern for us, too.

[Garand]

Sourdough, I feel very sorry that you are dealing with Macula Degeneration, my mother suffered through it for almost a decade at the end of her life. It is not a pleasant way to experience your golden years. As for pooping in the bush in -0F temperatures, I can reflect on earlier experiences of field exercises in Fort Wainwright Alaska and Northern Canada when I was a young soldier, never an enjoyable experience.

[Nik]

Just a reminder about igloo: IIRC, a proper igloo has a 'cold trap' arrangement, so living area / shelf is sufficiently (*) above the arch / lintel of entry tunnel. Occupants' body heat mostly stays trapped beneath the 'dome'. Think 'Diving Bell'...

*) Sorry, I cannot remember the recommended recipe, but it must have been about a hand-span...

[Tugaloo]

-25° F?
When I used to hunt; I remember answering nature's call in 20° F. Squatting in deep snow was worse than the cold.
As a precaution, we stockpile wood and we also live in a national forest.
When I was a grunt, I remember getting dirt splinters in my elbows, knees and other places. General hygiene will be a serious problem.

[RICHFL]

You do not mention moving about camp to include waste management, ever try to have a bowel movement at -25 f? It takes time! What about gathering fire wood to warm your shelter? Not to mention hunting/fishing.

[Tugaloo]

I knew Dick Proenneke (actually only chatted with him a few times at Port Alsworth, on Lake Clark) I built a cabin/hunting lodge on the North shore of Lake Clark, in the mid 80's. I am now 75 y/o and going blind with Macula Degeneration, a untreatable eye disease. I have lived in the Alaska wilderness for nearly all of the last 52 years, currently and for the last 23 years in the middle of an "Eight Million) acre National Forest.

I assure anyone that you do reach a physical condition and age, where it is prudent to not live alone in The Alaska Wilderness. This will be (for sure) my last winter on this mountain.

I hear you and understand where you are coming from. I'm the same age and Agent Orange positive.
Every three years, a gastroenterologist fills my gut up with air and removes polyps. Sometimes, they are benign and sometimes precancerous.
I'm familiar with Macula Degeneration, my wife has it in her genes. One of her parents had wet and the other had dry Macula Degeneration. Today, if they catch it early, they give shots in the eyes. It isn't a cure, but it does stop further degeneration.

We live in the Chattahoochee-Oconee NF. Although it is no where near as remote as where you live; we love it here.
From the tax assayer:



This is from T.R. "Teddy" Roosevelt and I know you will appreciate it and get what it means.

The farther one gets into the wilderness, the greater is the attraction of its lonely freedom.

Be thankful for the years you enjoyed, loved and the memories you have and the ones you will create.

[Sourdough]

I knew Dick Proenneke (actually only chatted with him a few times at Port Alsworth, on Lake Clark) I built a cabin/hunting lodge on the North shore of Lake Clark, in the mid 80's. I am now 75 y/o and going blind with Macula Degeneration, a untreatable eye disease. I have lived in the Alaska wilderness for nearly all of the last 52 years, currently and for the last 23 years in the middle of an "Eight Million) acre National Forest.

I assure anyone that you do reach a physical condition and age, where it is prudent to not live alone in The Alaska Wilderness. This will be (for sure) my last winter on this mountain.

[Tugaloo]

The problem with people like "Registror". it they are regurgitating "BOOK" learning, not "Boots in the Field" experience.

You nailed it!!!

Registror reads books which may or may be good advice. Then, he regurgitates his foolish bull malarkey as fact and it is far from any resemblance of fact.

During WWII and other wars or conflicts, some survived an incredible experience without anything other than the clothes on their backs. How they survived with nothing more is beyond me.

Here's an interesting example:
http://aloneinthewilderness.com
Dick Proenneke's story is fascinating; however, he had bush pilots who delivered his mail, brought mail, coffee, sugar and more. So it was not a pure TEOTWAWKI survival.
We agree with Dick Proenneke, survival is not possible without good coffee.. LOL

As he grew old, he moved into an assisted living home until he died.

[Sourdough]

The problem with people like "Registror". it they are regurgitating "BOOK" learning, not "Boots in the Field" experience.

[Tugaloo]

You're just right that you didn't explain it clearly enough

Even when the OP is right, he gets it wrong.

[YourBro]

You're just right that you didn't explain it clearly enough

[registror]

they all use hollow hairs to trap air. Same thing with the igloo. The Innuit had no fire inside of their igloos at -50F and didn't need any. Trapped body heat does the trick and it's trapped air that provides the insulating effect. Trapped air stops heat loss to conduction, if nothing but air is touching the heat source. If there's no air movement being allowed, no heat can be lost to convection, either. Air is a very, very poor conductor of heat and only about 10% of heat is lost to radiation. So, if you trap enough air around a heat source, the source stays hot, as long as it's got an on-going way of producing heat (ie, your metabolism). If you stay active and well fed, your metabolism is roaring right along on cold weather, because it HAS to do so. OLympic swimmers MUST eat 10,000 calories per day while in training. and they AINT fat. Water is 20x more efficient at conducting heat away from a source than is trapped air. Those guys work out heavily for 4-5 hours per day, in cool water. So, yes, they burn 6000+ calories more per day than a guy who just walked that many hours at room temps on flat pavement.

It does not matter how you get the insulative effect, as long as you dont have to CARRY the insulation. When you're talking a shelter, then the insulation can be quite bulky and heavy and it wont matter in the slightest, but that shelter has to be SMALL, sealed and dense enough to trap all of your body heat. If the shelter is too big, your body heat is dissipated into the air inside of a too-large shelter and thus, wasted/wont warm you.

People seem to "think' that modern clothing is not as effective as caribou or seal skins. The skins might be thinner and lighter than layers of various types of insulation/wool garments, but if you put enough of such things around you, you'll stay warm enough. The issue is, can you still accomplish tasks while lugging around this clothing? However, if you score enough food in the first 50 days of the Alone challenge, all you'll be doing for the last 50 days is holing up inside of your shelter. With 7 layers of clothing around you, using fine, soft debris between each layer,, 18" of soft, dry debris and 4 layers of tarp sealed around you, you'll be warm enough inside of your triangular 4x4x7 ft sleeping shelter. This is especially true if you've made the 5 ft high wind-breaks around your shelter and the Siberian fire lay. Make them out of poles, brush, debris, and there will be no way that high winds will be able to steal heat from your shelter.

You do NOT want to have to heat your shelter with fire, or even with hot rocks, if you can help it, cause doing so requires you to be burning calories getting the firewood. You need to be careful and efficient with what you do out there, so injury doesn't take you out and so that you minimize your calorie-losses.