LAND is key

[Oscar Wilde]

[where do you draw the line in telling people?]

I don't tell people things.... I'll pose a (hopefully) thought provoking question .... if a discussion takes root as is often the case I will again ask the person's opinion of current social developments and will share my observations and opinions as well .... if I detect a lack of interest I wish them good fortune and walk away.

[I come from an extremely disfunctional family, but have a problem with thinking of them starving or dying of thirst while I sat, well-fed and watered, in my retreat. I know the survival mentality dictates that those who fail to prepare, prepare to fail, but is this mindset something you guys would be able to do when it comes down to it?]

As long as you are willing to accommodate them during and following the calamity make certain that you prep for them as well or your enjoyment in your retreat will be short lived .....given their nature as you have described that might just be the case anyway ..... I will share with those I encounter so long as they put forth an effort to provide for themselves. Continue to share your thoughts and spread the news. Good luck.
O.W.

[waitnc]

What to tell the other parties you want in this endeavor? Getting back to self determination, grow more of your own things, sell items at the farmers market. You should know what their thoughts are to a degree I would assume? You don't want a Condo put up next door to your simpler less energy demanding home would you?

[Bavarian]

Fastfranny: I don't know what to tell you on this matter. Each person has to do what they think is best. I'm trying to over-prepare if there is such a thing because I know I'll have some family that will need help. I'm storing and growing food as much as I can. But, who can say how long it'll have to last. If someone can't contribute, they're dooming everyone else in a protracted situation. If I have unprepared family show up, I'm putting an axe, shovel, hoe, etc. in their hand and they'll go to work! If we can get through the short term, we can make it in the long term.

On another note, FYI, the History Channel did a program on the Irish Potato Famine. According to the show, a large family can live on potatoes produced on a quarter-acre of land. Patato recipes anyone?

[forever_frost]

I tried growing several kinds of veggies and fruit trees and have killed them all. I really suck at this.

Fortuantely, I have a plan B.

[prkchp76]

i think land is wonderfull though if you have to leave it forever wouldnt that wasted money had been better to use on supplies just a thought

[avking]

I did not read the entire thread, just the first post. In it, you said the land must have year round water. I agree 100% with that, but a stream or river are not what you want. A natural spring that gravity feeds into a holding tank is your #1 option and a well with solar power pump is your #2 option. Your river or creek is hard to get water out of and can run dry and/or become contaminated. Sure, so can my spring or well, but not as easily.

I have a natural artisan spring that feeds a several thousand gallon tank. The feed pipe is 3' below the freeze depth, so around 8' or so. The tank is also burried about the same depth. The nice thing about this, is that you can not poison my water easily nor can you even tell where the source is from. It is all underground. The water pressure is not great, but the gravity feed means I will always have water, and I can run a decent shower from the pressure I get.

Our well runs off solar power and provides much higher volume and a lot better pressure. We run the entire 4 bedroom house and have excellent pressure with the combination pump and storage tank. This tank is about 250 feet higher up the hill than the artisan tank, so gravity has a lot more time to work. Out shelter has the ability to use water from just the artisan tank, but I plan to install some pipe so the main tank can fill the artisan tank, thus providing two water sources for the shelter itself.

As for the amount of land you need. Well, it all depends on location. I know a lot of places where just 1 acre or less would be fine, because it is surrounded by national forrest. We have a little over 100 acres and have to pass through several other ranches to get to ours. We have right of way for the road. That provides us with a great deal of privacy and anyone driving down the highway would not even know we exist. It is three miles and well over 1000' elevation gain to the closest county road. The North and West property lines connect to BLM land and it is about 25 miles overland in either direction to hit a county road and a lot further to see any paved road. But, we are only about an hour or so from a decent sized city, so we have the convenience of going to town without the hazards in a bug out situation. I really feel my BOL is pretty perfect for me, but I have to travel around 900 miles to get to it. I plan to move to it full time as soon as I can, but that could still be a couple years away.

If for some reason, we lost or could no longer stay in this location, I have an alternate site already picked out. A small mining claim in Montana that is forever away from any population center. It would mean tent living until a cabin could be built, but hey, at least I know the area well and know how to get there. I do not have any caches in that location, nor do I plan on any.

just my 2 cents