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12 Ga Shotgun... No one should be without one

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  • 12 Ga Shotgun... No one should be without one

    The 12 gauge shotgun is cheap, effective, and should be a part of every home defense arsenal.
    Below is a link to ballistic tests showing damage and penetration for many different loads using ballistics gel.
    It's very informative and makes for a good read.
    The "Cliffs Notes" version is use nothing less than #4 buck for defense.
    Personally, I would never use anything less than Low Recoil 00 buck.
    Federal Flight Control is awesome stuff.

    http://www.tacticalshotgun.ca/ballistics_shotgun.html


    Chris
    The 12ga.... It's not just for rabbits anymore.

  • #2
    could not agree more

    the basic shotgun is a must!!!!
    if you have nothing else....get a shotgun

    just my .02
    Go ahead and run, you'll only die tired

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    • #3
      i got the mossberg 500 with the nine shot tube and the whole riot setup
      the pack that plays together stays together

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      • #4
        I totaly agree with the 'home defense". I have a good WIn. mdl 12 light-weight for game. I would love to find a Rem. 870. Did they not make a Mdl 870 with barrles and tubes that would interchange? Whats the going price for them? If I don't have to go 'fixed barrel" on a 12 guage I try not to. Any adivise or feed back?
        "And with a collection of minds and talent, they survived"

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        • #5
          Rem 870 Good Choice

          Originally posted by pathfinder3081 View Post
          I totaly agree with the 'home defense". I have a good WIn. mdl 12 light-weight for game. I would love to find a Rem. 870. Did they not make a Mdl 870 with barrles and tubes that would interchange? Whats the going price for them? If I don't have to go 'fixed barrel" on a 12 guage I try not to. Any adivise or feed back?

          Remington 870 shotgun is without a doubt the most popular pump action shotgun going. There are endless accessories for them: Barrells, Stocks, Extension Tubes, Side Saddles etc. I find the 870 to be a highly reliable and robust firearm. With a steel reciever and trigger guard safety buttom, I have found it to be much more reliable with various ammunition than say a Mossberg 500.

          Mossberg 500s have aluminum receivers and top safeties which I have seen wear out or break over time. Additionally, as I've mentioned in a previous post; I've seen one too many of the 500's trigger mechanisms break rear of the trigger guard. This renders the safety inoperable and can cause accidental discharge while cycling the action. The trigger mechanisms on most newer Mossberg 500s seem to be made out of an inferior polymer. Most Rem 870 triggers are made out of a better polymer, aluminum or steel.

          Barrels are easily replacable, Other manufactures including Mossberg make replacement or specialized barrels for the 870. TAC Star is one company that manufactures extension tubes for the mag tube adding several more rounds depending on barrel length. You CANNOT add a barrel extension to a Mossberg 500 (one of the reasons I got rid of mine).

          Some Newer Rem 870s have incorporated dimples on the end of the mag tube to prevent the addition of a mag extension (870 HD). Once you remove the barrel on the 870 you can see if it has these dimples. These dimples can be removed (drill/dremel). Watch out for state laws where applicable.

          Academy Sports, Big 5, Dicks, Walmart etc all carry the Remington 870s.
          You can always check your local Pawn Shops for a good used 870. Prices will vary depending on model variant and associated bells and whistles. They are very affordable. I like the 870s simplicity, robustness and reliability. I own 2 myself. Good luck.

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          • #6
            If you could only have one gun, what would it be? I would cry bitter salt tears not to have my beloved handguns. I would waste away not to have my hunting rifles. But if it truly came down to one...Well it would have to be my Remington 870 in 12 gage. It works for home defense. It takes birds on the wing. And buckshot or slugs will take big game.
            Those who would trade freedom for security will end up with neither.

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            • #7
              I agree with you guys, the 870 is the only way to go. Now, does anyone know how much a Deer Slayer Barrell costs?
              G.I.H.S.O. Going In Hot, Safety Off.

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              • #8
                Ford vs Chevy

                you could find the exact same arguements against the 870 and for the Mossy as well... it's just personal preference, most I know who rely on their Shotgun for work rely on the 590a1 mossy or benelli
                WHAT IF THE AMERICA YOU KNEW, WAS ABOUT TO CHANGE?

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                • #9
                  Point blank birdshot is a surgeons' nightmare.
                  Have you ever heard anyone surviving it that wasn't wearing armour at point blank?

                  I know a fellow on another forum that was bird hunting and a
                  ground hog came up out of his hole about 15-20ft away.
                  He said the bird shot blew a daylight hole straight threw him the size of his fist.
                  Don't get me wrong, bigger caliber loads may give you more insurance
                  but even the lowly birshot is deadly at ranges you would shoot at someone
                  inside your house.

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                  • #10
                    It has been argued that the glazier makes the most effective handgun bullet ever. Can you imagine how many times more effective a shotgun is?
                    Those who would trade freedom for security will end up with neither.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      I'm in agreement. Though I do prefer the Mossberg to the Remington. I feel that the 12 ga is a must have. The shotgun can be tailored to your needs simply by loading different types of ammuntion. Like Dracos said, slugs and buckshot for larger game and home defense, to birdshot, to signal flares, to non-lethal rubber shot and beanbags. I can swap out the barrel on my 500 in under a minute from the HD 18.5" to a 24" rifled. With a good set of sights and lots of practice, 75 yard groups are not only possible but probable.
                      AND THEY ARE CHEAP!!!!

                      You can find second hand Mossy's for under $300 easy.

                      I'm a Shotgun fanatic. I actually keep more 12ga ammo, than 5.56

                      Checkout shotgunworld.com if you're interested. Lot's of good info in the "tactical section"

                      On a side note: I'm sure that bird shot will make a nasty wound, but if anyone ever breaks into my house they will be greeted by NOTHING less than 00. Bird shot is for birds
                      Last edited by slowz1k; 04-07-2009, 04:30 PM.
                      The 12ga.... It's not just for rabbits anymore.

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                      • #12
                        Apoint to consider on shotgun home defense. You will not likely be firing at range of more than 10 feet or so in home invasion. At that range shot load is still pretty much a unit no matter the shot size. However, bird shot will lose energy rapidly in the event of miss on contact with drywall, curtains, glass, etc. This reduces the risk of downrange peripheral damage. Guess this is not an issue if you live alone without neighbors.
                        If at first, you don't succeed, suck harder.

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                        • #13
                          Over penetration is always an issue when talking Home Defense. Nearby dwellings, and in home occupants are always a cause for concern. The issues that I have with using bird shot is that if it will not penetrate a few layers of drywall, there's a better than average chance that it won't penetrate an intruder enough to incapacitate. I'm not saying that he wouldn't be hurt and bleeding, but when I have two children and my wife in the balance, the intruder needs to be put down as quickly and effeciently as possible. In the event that this intruder is doped up, then bird shot is the wrong answer for sure.
                          A common theory is that if it's a close range target, the shot will act as one BIG projectile. This is very untrue. Each ball comming out of that shell has it's very own individual ballistic properties that are completely independent of the rest. This means that when the target receives a full load of bird shot, the wound profile will be essentially the same as getting shot with a BB gun at the SAME velocity (1400 +/- FPS) multiple times in the same area. I know that this is a simplistic example, but it illustrates my meaning. The bird shot does have lethal "potential", but potential is not the same as probable.
                          Case in point: Look at the guy VP Cheney shot with a pheasant load to the face. One pellet did actually penetrate the chest cavity, but he walked off the field anyway.

                          I'm not trying to tell anyone how to run their guns, and bird shot is better than harsh language any day. Everyone has different situations, and should run what they're comfortable with.... And always have a backup plan
                          I prepare for the worst, that way I'm never dissappointed. :D
                          Last edited by slowz1k; 05-04-2009, 12:24 PM.
                          The 12ga.... It's not just for rabbits anymore.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            As far as 12 ga. loads for home defense... anything you have in your
                            gun is going to be "devastating!!"
                            I found this on thefiringline.com
                            ------------------------------------------------------------------------
                            --------------------------------------------------------------------

                            I worked as a Paramedic in central Georgia for 13 years. I saw many gunshot wounds. Besides the cases I worked, I went over to the ER to check out any GSW that came in, as our barracks was in the parking lot out behind the ER, and I was particularly interested in gunshot wounds.
                            I was fascinated by the lethality of birdshot wounds to the torso.
                            In the course of my career I saw 14 close range birdshot wounds to the torso and every one of them died.
                            Most of these injuries occurred inside a house, so you are talking 10 feet to maybe 25 feet max.
                            We did have one sad case, a teenage boy was crossing a barbed wire fence. He had a .410 with number 6 shot. The gun went off and hit his brother in the back of the neck, ten feet away.
                            The kid was dead when the ambulance arrived.
                            Most of the shotgun torso wounds I saw were like that, we would get there ten minutes after the shooting and the guy would be graveyard dead.
                            I saw hundreds of gunshot wounds and close range birdshot was the most lethal gunshot injury I saw.

                            If any of y'all doubt the effectiveness of birdshot, it is easy to do a penetration test.
                            I had heard that birdshot would not penetrate a leather coat. I doubted this so I made a test. I got a pair of old workboots, the sole was worn out but the ankle leather was still good, easily as thick as the leather of a coat.
                            I got a 20 gauge shotgun loaded with number 8 shot. At fifteen feet I shot the boot. The shot went right through the leather, and went right out the other side. The pattern was familiar, about 1 1/2 inches wide, a rough jagged hole.
                            Then I put a pine 1x4 into the other boot. I figured that 3/4 inch of pine was a pretty good simulation of human bone.
                            I fired again. The shot went through the leather and blew right through the board. This time, only a few shot exited the other side of the boot.
                            I had the feeling that if someone had been wearing this boot they would have had their foot blown off, it would have given the orthopedic surgeon a very long night to try to save it.
                            Last edited by TLM; 05-04-2009, 06:01 PM.

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                            • #15
                              A few yeas ago a freind of mine was getting together a ammo order (back when it was a around). I got some #4 buck from him. After shooting 3 rounds of it, I said to myself "this is to much fun, because this stuff is to expensive". It will cut you in half!
                              I am sure of it. It has 27 pellets, I think.
                              I still have not gotten around to gettin my Mdl 870. Really have not seen anything that I liked at the shows. But I will.
                              "And with a collection of minds and talent, they survived"

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