everyone says the AK is SO "durable" under abuse and neglect.

[registror]

well, how about you DONT abuse/neglect your life-saving device, hmm? WHO claims that the AK is more accurate than the AR, or faster for getting the hits? is it better suited for mounting scopes, to include night scopes, lasers, red-dot sights? No, it is not. Is its safety swift and easy to manipulate? No, it most DEFINITELY is not! Are its sights and trigger pull superior/easily rectified,? No they are not. Does it have a.22lr conversion unit for cheap practice, indoor range-welcome, quiet foraging, offering a cheap subsonic option, fun for novices to train-with? No it does not. Will it take down and conceal in a backpack? Not the readily-available versions!. Is it available as an 80% or stripped lower? Maybe, I dont check on such things, cause it's inferior in all of these other ways. Does it take the GI mags, rds, parts, accessories? No it does not. Is it or its ammo lots cheaper than AR's and 223 ammo? not any more. The AR is well proven to be plenty reliable enough, folks.

[TRex2]

I agree with you, mostly. The AK is simply an option, for those who, for some reason, cannot obtain an AR.
Right now, I can obtain some cheap AK ammo (locally), but that may be just temporary.

[registror]

you can get an ambi safety for the AK, to make it usable with your thumb, like it should have been set up in the first place. If you are not fast and accurate, the guns handling qualities and lack of precision ammo dont hurt you much but the lack of a night scope and .22lr unit are very bad news..

[TRex2]

Yeah, it was meant to outshoot someone shooting at you with a 45 or a grease gun.

That and a cheap infantry weapon, where they planned on having a dozen or more of them pointed towards the enemy.

[registror]

anyone who 'thinks" that the AK is superior to a good AR-15 is NUTS, man.

[TRex2]

anyone who 'thinks" that the AK is superior to a good AR-15 is NUTS, man.

Well, generally speaking, I agree with you,
but the above statement says that you are comparing a run of the mill AK, with a custom AR.
You might get the opposite results if you compare a custom AK with a run of the mill AR.

Still I will stand by what I said, about an AK being a rifle for those who can't get an AR.

I know of a guy who carried an AK in the Baltics. Said it was easier to scrounge ammo, especially off of the guy he just shot. Must have been a fairly common practice, since Russians began distributing booby trapped AK magazines. Stick it in your rifle, fire two shots, pull the trigger a third time and you get blown up.

[registror]

sure, in Europe. Asian or Africa, but not here in the US and probably not in most of S america, either. By having the .22 unit, you bypass a lot of the ammo problems. If shtf, the N guard and active military ammo bunkers will be breeched. The .22lr and 223 and 9mm will be THE calibers bartered, found on the dead, found in vehicles, shelters, buildings. There's no cutomization needed to make the AR far superior to the AK. It's just optional and most of those options are not available for the AK, at any price. Anywhere but here, and any gun but the AR I'd rather have a silenced .22lr autorifle than any centerfire.

I'd qualify that statement with the possible exception of a silenced 9mm carbine, IF I could get at least SOME subsonic ammo for it. When you know better than to be out and about in daylight, there's very little advantage accruing to any centerfire, as vs the rimfire, and if that centerfire has no silencer or no night sights, it's inferior to the .22 that has both, along with subsonic ammo. A bit of glow-in-the-dark paint on the iron sights of a .22 autorifle and a 2x7 variable scope as a substitute for a binocular, in a see thru mount, goes a long ways as a shtf longarm. Running out of ammo is a death sentence. So is making noise or having flash at night.

Without modern medical care and the ability to rest for a month, a .22lr bullet in your torso means death. You might could run a red hot cleaning rod thru a thru and thru bullet wound in a limb, but you wont be doing so for a torso hit that didn't exit. The wax on the .22 bullet drags bacteria from the skin and clothing debris into the wound, meaning a horrific death from gangrene. A .22 hit is to be majorly feared. When they have no idea whence came the bullet, what can they do? spray off all of their ammo, calling in other enemies?::-) Their 'buddies' will have to finish them off, to stop their screaming and take their stuff. The silent .22 hit at night will thus be FAR more effective vs morale than the noisy centerfire hit in daylight.

Given night vision and a tunnel, some buried food caches and spiderholes, those silenced hits can occur several times per week. When it's just a hunk of woods, like any other, of course they'll move on. They'll have no choice in the matter. What will be sustaining them while they stay in your area, hmm? Having to maintain a constant watch is a very annoying drain on your resources. I"m resting in my tunnel. I've got buried food. I can keep up the attrition on your group for a year, costing you 100 men. and what will you gain by hanging around? Even if you can kill me, that doesn't gain you my caches and even if it did, the food will sustain your group only a short while. So hanging around will be a total loser of a choice.

[BigEd63]

Q: Is the AK more durable and reliable?
A:Yes if made to the exacting military standards of counties like Russia, China and Bulgaria
I name those countries because I've actual experience with products from them from neutered to original configuration sans full auto.
Don't count on most of the US made and Century Arms Abortions to be unless it's the Yugo ones.
Accuracy:
Q: How accurate is an AK?
A: Again from experience with the top mention 3 and good "GI" type ammo 2-3MOA @ 100yds. And on occasions better with specific ammo.
That's within US standards for general issue.
No not match or competition grade but good for combat/field use.

Sights and Ergonomics
Here is a clouded area dependent on many factors so I'll be as brief as possible.

The AK-47 and AKM is entwined with Soviet/Eastern Bloc TRADOC which is pretty well unknown when compared to Western/NATO TRADOC and American marksmanship training.

For example the stock is generally deemed as too short and often stated as made for short armed people. WRONG: It's made for a different stance being more squared off to the target. Think a type of CQB/Mobile stance instead of the traditional semi bladed target shooters off hand stance.

The safety again a training issue same with the magazine release.

Sights: There's enough ways to overcome that with either top cover sights or a low mount red dot system.

Trigger not at all difficult to remedy if it's not century silent clown (MIM-e) garbage. Polish but DO NOT change angles!

Do I have one? No not currently. I'd like another decent quality one. But in a standard configuration as a trainer.

[TRex2]

Thank you, BigEd63 for an educated answer.
TRex2

[Garand]

Coming from a land where AK's have been banned for decades and AR 15's are unfortunately likely to follow within the next year, it is time to think outside the box and choose an effective, reliable alternative just in case.

[Dorobuta]

Another option in the AK family is the SKS - reliable, rugged, can be modified to use AK magazines. I used to have one in the paratrooper config. I put a RDS on it, and it was a very handy gun. To this day, I regret selling it.

BTW, AKs can be suppressed - they’re very similar to the blackout

[Tugaloo]

Garand, I have a feeling that in the US there will be another AWB. Currently, some states limit magazine capacity etc. Congress is discussing federal licensing and special insurance required for firearms owners.

Dorobuta, The doctrine of the West is aimed fire and the doctrine of the East is spray fire. The SKS as the standard issue was the last of the old Com block's aimed fire doctrine.

[orangetom1999]

By Garand...

Garand, I have a feeling that in the US there will be another AWB. Currently, some states limit magazine capacity etc. Congress is discussing federal licensing and special insurance required for firearms owners.

You know....some Americans are incredibly stupid...and I believe many in leadership positions are counting on Americans being incredibly stupid to the point that they know more about the demigods of Sports...Hollywood and the Kardashians than any kind or history or real thinking.,...,thinking is difficult....

Many of us including myself often avoid thinking....it can be very very difficult versus emoting....instant gratification followed by "Entitlement " thinking.,

Does one license a right...a fundamental right from God....does government license that???

Did they discuss this concept or understanding in Government or Civics classes or what ever they are calling it today..??

Does government have the authority to license a Right from God??

Does government therefore have the ability to require insurance on a Right from God????


Remember...thinking is difficult...many of us avoid it for a lifetime...


Do some of you even know enough history to remember that the British did not trust the Colonial Americans with a state of the art smoothbore musket......???? Do any of you remember that history???....I do!!

Did those British Scoundrels ever leave America or did they sneak back into this country and run for President and Congress....state governments.???


Has it ever occurred to many of you that.......

"If you cannot be trusted with a state of the art firearm....you will not also be trusted with a vote???"

Remember...thinking is difficult....some of us avoid it for a lifetime.


Why are not those phony conservative Republicans saying this....about voting and guns....??

Ever think about that???f Remember how difficult thinking can be!!!

Be careful about the Republicans...they too are not the product advertised.....Be Warned on this.


You do not license or insure your Rights from God...this has been born out in court cases for many many years now...

Once you force licensing on your Rights from God......there is a switch which has taken place without most people knowing or being aware it has taken place.....

And that switch is changing Rights from God into privileges granted by the Sovereign......and privileges can be changed, modified or removed at the will of the Sovereign or Government for any reason.

This is not Limited Government.....

Someone here is trying to go against their oath of Office and the Constitution of the United States and hoping most Americans will not catch on...and they would be mostly correct when dealing with television and or movie trained educated Americans.

You do not put licenses or insurance on your Rights from God...!!!!!


One has to become educated in pure stupid not to know this...and so I was for many many years before the olde ones educated me in History and law cases. And law cases are indeed History.

All the way back to the Code of Hammurabi and older..

Be Warned the Ishmaelites counting on your ignorance and not knowing...

My non Ishmaelite .02s,
Orangetom

[Garand]

One thing that I have noticed with the young people that I have associated from all over North America and the UK for the last 2 decades is that history is not a big part of the educational system these days. So this generation is doomed to repeat the mistakes of the past.

[Tugaloo]

One thing that I have noticed with the young people that I have associated from all over North America and the UK for the last 2 decades is that history is not a big part of the educational system these days. So this generation is doomed to repeat the mistakes of the past.

Very true. They aren't taught their Rights or taught an interpreted version that defines the word militia quite differently than it was intended.

As there are too many to C&P all of them; here are a few.

"A strong body makes the mind strong. As to the species of exercises, I advise the gun. While this gives moderate exercise to the body, it gives boldness, enterprise and independence to the mind. Games played with the ball, and others of that nature, are too violent for the body and stamp no character on the mind. Let your gun therefore be your constant companion of your walks." - Thomas Jefferson, letter to Peter Carr, August 19, 1785

"A free people ought not only to be armed, but disciplined..."
- George Washington, First Annual Address, to both House of Congress, January 8, 1790

"On every occasion [of Constitutional interpretation] let us carry ourselves back to the time when the Constitution was adopted, recollect the spirit manifested in the debates, and instead of trying [to force] what meaning may be squeezed out of the text, or invented against it, [instead let us] conform to the probable one in which it was passed."
- Thomas Jefferson, letter to William Johnson, 12 June 1823

“They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
- Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759

"I ask who are the militia? They consist now of the whole people, except a few public officers."
- George Mason, Address to the Virginia Ratifying Convention, June 4, 1788

"Before a standing army can rule, the people must be disarmed, as they are in almost every country in Europe. The supreme power in America cannot enforce unjust laws by the sword; because the whole body of the people are armed, and constitute a force superior to any band of regular troops."
- Noah Webster, An Examination of the Leading Principles of the Federal Constitution, October 10, 1787

"Besides the advantage of being armed, which the Americans possess over the people of almost every other nation, the existence of subordinate governments, to which the people are attached, and by which the militia officers are appointed, forms a barrier against the enterprises of ambition, more insurmountable than any which a simple government of any form can admit of."
- James Madison, Federalist No. 46, January 29, 1788

"The right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. A well regulated militia, composed of the body of the people, trained to arms, is the best and most natural defense of a free country."
- James Madison, I Annals of Congress 434, June 8, 1789

Certainly not the interpretations our children are taught..