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  • Best ar-15 defensive ammo

    What do you guys think is the best defensive ammo for an ar-15 would it be m855 or hornady tap 75 .223 or do you guys have diffrent thoughts?
    Honey its just the cats, Put that @#$%ing thing away!

  • #2
    Originally posted by neverknow View Post
    What do you guys think is the best defensive ammo for an ar-15 would it be m855 or hornady tap 75 .223 or do you guys have diffrent thoughts?
    You must have been reading my mind on this subject. If money was no object I would lean towards the TAP ammo. Nickle plated cases help with feeding and stripping cartridges from the magazine. Additionally it has a lower muzzle signature than standard ammo.

    I've found this ammunition functions ultra reliably and is very accurate out to 200 plus yards. After this distance it starts to fall off. If I had the money to burn I would purchase this ammo in quantity. It's not cheap for very good reasons.

    One thing to consider also about military ammunition is that while the movie "Full Metal Jacket" left an impression on many a novice shooter that this is the ammo one must have; it's primary purpose is not to kill.
    However I would not feel under-gunned utilizing the M-855. It's quality ammo.

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    • #3
      I found a fellow with the hornady for 200.00 for 200 rounds worth it? and also ouch!:(
      Honey its just the cats, Put that @#$%ing thing away!

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      • #4
        Originally posted by neverknow View Post
        I found a fellow with the hornady for 200.00 for 200 rounds worth it? and also ouch!:(
        Actually that's not a bad price, as this ammo retails for much more. Ouch is right. 200 rounds is just a little less than a standard combat loadout (210 rds) for the AR-15/M-16 platform. If I had the extra money I would get it. The only problem I would foresee is once you run out of this ammo you may have to re-sight your firearm unless you affixed a cartridge conversion table to your stock. This would enable you to adjust your sights back to the M-855 once you ran out of the TAP ammo. If your shooting within 100 yds I would not worry about it; especially if your shooting at center mass. If I was a millionaire I would get the TAP ammo in quantity, but in my case I would settle for the M-855 or 55 grain FMJ as there is alot to be said about quantity. Don't find yourself short on ammo if a less expensive brand fires just as reliably and accurately throught your firearm.
        Last edited by Bayou Blaster; 07-28-2009, 12:52 AM. Reason: Additional Info

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        • #5
          Money is an issue!

          TAP is just too much $$$ for me to stock in quanity. Bayou answered pretty well. A buck a round seems to be the norm currently for TAP. 200rds are almost a basicload. At 28rds per 30rd mag you could load 7 mags (a basicload) with like 4rds left over.

          If you use that as your primary BO basicload having a chart/conversion table on your rifle as Bayou suggested is a good way to go for engaging med-long to long range targets.

          Quanity VS Quality can be a very fine line when it comes to ammo. I'm fine with stocking Lake City M855 and SS109 in quanity. I consider it quality ammo as well so two birds one stone.

          Besides your AR is a combat rifle not a tack driver. Mine shoot better than I'd ever be able to. I'm in a good mood cause I just picked up 4k in new Federal ammo today!!! :D
          Well, for me, the action is the juice.....I'm in.

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          • #6
            The hornady he is saleing me is the brass color in the red box not the nickle plated version in the black box, is that odd? and i was only going to buy about 200 for bob bag you think thats enough for my bob?
            Honey its just the cats, Put that @#$%ing thing away!

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            • #7
              Originally posted by neverknow View Post
              The hornady he is saleing me is the brass color in the red box not the nickle plated version in the black box, is that odd? and i was only going to buy about 200 for bob bag you think thats enough for my bob?
              I could be wrong, but I've never seen TAP utilize brass cartridges or red boxes. Always seen it in the black box and nickle plated cases. Careful they could be reloads or something else?

              http://hornady.com/story.php?s=149

              https://www.hornady.com/shop/?ps_ses...aec57bb74a84a5
              Last edited by Bayou Blaster; 07-28-2009, 09:09 PM.

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              • #8
                Bayou these are what they look like http://www.hornadyle.com/products/mo...2&sID=73&pID=5
                Honey its just the cats, Put that @#$%ing thing away!

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by neverknow View Post
                  Bayou these are what they look like http://www.hornadyle.com/products/mo...2&sID=73&pID=5
                  That ammo should function just fine in your 1/7 twist AR.

                  As Mags and I have previously stated we would both be happy shooting the M855 ammunition. Again it boils down to a cash thing. That particular ammo (TAP) is a good deal for that price. Is it really necessary? Not when you already have the M855. If I had the money to splurge on it? Yes I would get it. But I would get enough of a particular Lot # to sight in the firearm while leaving enough reserved for a on-foot bug-out basic loadout.

                  When bugging out on foot equipment weight is critical. If you need more than 7 mags in a on-foot bug-out situation your in a world of hurt. Yes if I could afford it in quantity I would get it and reserve it for that purpose. Just like I would love to get enough Cor-Bon DPX ammo in quantity for my AKS variants.
                  Last edited by Bayou Blaster; 07-29-2009, 10:54 AM.

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                  • #10
                    Ok do i get the winchester white box or lake city loose ammo m855?
                    Honey its just the cats, Put that @#$%ing thing away!

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by neverknow View Post
                      Ok do i get the winchester white box or lake city loose ammo m855?
                      I would get the Lake City M855 (Nato Designation SS 109). This ammunition is optimised for the shorter 1/7 twist rate barrel.

                      In your case I would NOT recommend the Winchester White box. If you can't get anything else, only then would I get the Q3131(A) this is manufactured by IMI. It's XM193 55gr FMJ. It is not as good as the M855 ammo. This ammo is optimised for the longer barrel, longer twist rate AR-15 variants.

                      Hope this helps.:)

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                      • #12
                        +1 to the M855 loose over the Win.
                        Well, for me, the action is the juice.....I'm in.

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                        • #13
                          I have never actually needed to shoot anybody with a 223 rifle of any sort but as far as function, The TAP has worked fine in my tests. I also tested and decided upon Federal TRU 55gr Ballistic Tip, It is very very similar in every way to the Hornaday TAP 55gr round.

                          So I have about 100 rounds that I keep handy of the TAP and 500 rounds stockpiled of the Federal sealed away in the ammo stores.

                          I think if money was no object either round would be great. (I haven't been able to find the Federal anywhere in the last 6 months so it might be moot)

                          I would get at least 200 rounds of premium ammo and then stock up on M193 or M855. From my understanding with a slower twist rate that was common in the vietnam era M16 the 193 was stabilized well in flight but upset upon contact causing much more wounding than the 855 does in the newer high twist rifles. I wasn't around for vietnam and haven't had to shoot anybody with one of the newones so this is all from my research and second hand accounts, ballistic tests, etc.

                          The heavier (62gr ss109) style rounds tend to penetrate better but often go right through with less transfer of energy to the target. This makes sense if you do the physics calculations with a 1 in 7 twist and the velocities the 62 grain bullets travel at. You don't get the tumbling that you would with a 1 in 10 or less twist with a 55gr bullet which has a higher velocity given the same powder charge. The original M16 had a 1 in 12 twist, which stabilized the bullet enough for flight, but just barely, anything would upset the bullet. This isn't so great if it is a tree branch or leaf, but a good thing if the bullet is hitting a human target.

                          Anyhow, this is just my opinion and FYI on the matter. Since we pretty much have high twist barrels now, I think the ballistic tip or hollowpoint rounds are a superior design for modern civilian operated rifles. The military can't use expanding rounds but we can and should take full advantage. Since we don't have the slow twist barrels that allow the bullets to tumble and create a wound channel that way, we can use expanding bullets to bring back some of the energy transfer that is lost with high twist heavy bullets.

                          I think everyone agrees that the TAP is good stuff! I think the Federal TRU is also good stuff too. Please consider getting some as your budget allows, it is superior for defensive use than the 855 or 193 ammo (I have thousands of rounds of 193 for practice and some 855 for when I might need more penetration (and can't get out the 50bmg or anything larger than 223)
                          My weapon can kill, it isn't limited to mere assault

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                          • #14
                            Bayou you mean these rounds correct? http://www.ammunitiontogo.com/catalo...enetrator-ammo
                            Honey its just the cats, Put that @#$%ing thing away!

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by neverknow View Post
                              Bayou you mean these rounds correct? http://www.ammunitiontogo.com/catalo...enetrator-ammo
                              That would be it neverknow.

                              I think everyone here is pretty much of the same opinion concerning Hornady's TAP brand ammunition. It's quality defensive ammo. Cwconnertx, Mag and I are in agreement that some of this ammo is a good thing to have in reserve. Again If you can, I would recommend purchasing at least enough of a Lot# to practice, sight-in and have enough left in reserve for at least a basic load out. I agree with Mags that TAP ammo is too expensive for our purposes to purchase/store in bulk. The M855 is a compromise round of sorts. It's not as expensive as TAP but offers better penetration and stabilization when negotiating obstacles in it's flight path than XM 193 which is NOT optimized for your 1/7 twist rate barrel. It still can be used however.

                              I have not tried the Federal TRU 55gr ammunition that cwconnertx has recommended, but I respect his opinion and have tried Federal ammo in other calibers and found it both accurate and reliable. Again remember that 55gr ammo is not optimized for your fiream. It's at least worth a try.

                              I have also utilized lead-tipped hunting ammo in .223 with great effectiveness against hogs. Something to consider if you can find it or load your own.

                              Most all ammunition can be effectively employed knowing it's limitations as well as advantages. Good luck.
                              Last edited by Bayou Blaster; 07-29-2009, 11:59 AM.

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